What a journey, what a discovery! I know others have the same question, I got this morning in my email, so I’ll let you read over my shoulder as I answered him:
I have once again been inspired by its (So You Don’t Want to Go to Church Anymore) contents and spirit. i am a pastor but feel just as you obviously did when you stepped into a real expression of living the life, and would love to do the same sort of thing as i see the future along this path. So my question is: how do you make the necessary money to live?
Here’s what I wrote back:
Honestly, I think the need to “make the necessary money to live” is one of the first false responsibilities God liberates us from in this journey. So much of church life has been shaped by someone’s need to make an income or meet a budget. Looking back, I know there were many times as a pastor when I didn’t follow what Jesus wanted because I couldn’t figure out how my salary would get pad or how the “church” budget would be met. Institutions have to put such things first and money easily becomes the overriding source of survival.
Watchman Nee wrote some like, if a man is not willing to trust God for his finances, God will not entrust that man with his people. I didn’t like that when I first read it. It scared me. Now, 15 years of watching God provide for me without a fixed salary or income stream and sometimes in very bizarre ways, I look back knowing how real that is. I think two things have to be separated. What is God asking me to do? And, how does he want to resource me?” Surprisingly those are not the same question and they weren’t for Paul the apostle either. He saw no conflict between sharing the kingdom with people and making tents while he did it.
Growing up in ol’ the Puritan work ethic, those those things have always been one in the same for me. Now they aren’t. Now I see the work God has prepared for me in the world and him providing for me as two unconnected realities. And I don’t measure the value of the work he has asked of me by how much income in generates. Often the most significant things he has asked me to be a part of have generated no income at all. Over the last 15 years he has provided for me in incredible ways—through writing royalties, through speaking honorarium, through the generous gifts of some dear friends who wanted to see my life available to others, through painting a friends’ house, through the education consulting work, and through some really weird miraculous events that were completely unexpected and never again repeated.
God has a million ways to provide for his people. But I know that comes in the reality of God winning our trust, not people acting in independence hoping God will drop money in their lap in some magical way. I do know many people who have tried to “live by faith” by just pursuing their ministry or creative passions and have ended up financially ruined. This isn’t that. This freedom to live in his provision grows over time and the opportunity God gives us to help others on this journey. It is an organic reality won in our relationship with him, not an act of hoping God will take care of us.
I’ve seen many, many brothers go down this road and God has provided for them in so many diverse ways. Working for a salary that is tied to “our ministry” is one of the most restrictive environments in which we put ourselves. Our loyalties get divided. It is difficult to hear him when we’re always focused on how what it means for us financially. And trying to make ministry pay for itself often leads to twisted ways we distort the Gospel, manipulate others, and create dependency on our ministries that only belongs to the Father of all. When one is set free from that you can’t believe the clarity of insight and the simplicity of his leading that follows.
But I know the journey to that reality is not easy. I pray you have the grace and courage to follow him as his purpose unfolds in your life. It just may be that God wants your life and gifts available full-time to help equip others in this journey, and if so he will provide for that in some wonderful ways. That will usually come when the opportunities fill your time, rather than raising support so that you can fill your time with ministry. Ministry grows organically and I find when people are needed full time to help others, they already have a resource to help them do it, even if that is the generosity of friends who see what God’s doing in your life and they want to help give it away to others. If not, just remember that the value of your gift isn’t measured by whether or not you get to do it full time.
Very good response. I really enjoyed reading what God has done in your heart in this area.
Christianity started in Palestine as a fellowship; it moved to Greece and became a philosophy; it moved to Italy and became an institution; it moved to Europe and became a culture; it came to America and became an enterprise.
A young woman then asked 2 power packed questions.
1) “A business? But isn’t it supposed to be a body?”
2) “But when a body becomes a business, isn’t that a prostitute?”
Read the whole article at http://davidagrant.blogspot.com/2009/11/wow-what-question_17.html
I think it works in another way also. I think we become content with less. A simple room, a simple meal. Not working for the next house, or car, or vacation. In my younger years, I have always seen people who lived so simply and gave away more than they kept. What weirdos I used to say! How stupid! But now I get it. If there is less of You in You, and more of Him in You, His part needs nothing. And the residual part of You left in You, needs so much less. Confusing, I suppose. But the most incredible feeling. Most liberating freedom.
A great reminder Wayne; thank you so much.
Very good response. I really enjoyed reading what God has done in your heart in this area.
Christianity started in Palestine as a fellowship; it moved to Greece and became a philosophy; it moved to Italy and became an institution; it moved to Europe and became a culture; it came to America and became an enterprise.
A young woman then asked 2 power packed questions.
1) “A business? But isn’t it supposed to be a body?”
2) “But when a body becomes a business, isn’t that a prostitute?”
Read the whole article at http://davidagrant.blogspot.com/2009/11/wow-what-question_17.html
I think it works in another way also. I think we become content with less. A simple room, a simple meal. Not working for the next house, or car, or vacation. In my younger years, I have always seen people who lived so simply and gave away more than they kept. What weirdos I used to say! How stupid! But now I get it. If there is less of You in You, and more of Him in You, His part needs nothing. And the residual part of You left in You, needs so much less. Confusing, I suppose. But the most incredible feeling. Most liberating freedom.
A great reminder Wayne; thank you so much.
Thanks for sharing your response, Wayne.
When our son got out of college and wanted to get married, there was also the question of “how do you make the necessary money to live”. I think I said something like “get a paying job”.
In this past year, it’s been fun to see the Father provide for our needs in spite of a bad economy.
‘This freedom to live in his provision grows over time and the opportunity God gives us to help others on this journey. It is an organic reality won in our relationship with him, not an act of hoping God will take care of us.’
ah, a great time of sharing…..i love how you commented on getting away from putting value on what God calls one to do by if they make money doing it or not….
i’ll have to read this again when i’m more awake ha ha!
thanks for sharing,
todd
Thanks for sharing your response, Wayne.
When our son got out of college and wanted to get married, there was also the question of “how do you make the necessary money to live”. I think I said something like “get a paying job”.
In this past year, it’s been fun to see the Father provide for our needs in spite of a bad economy.
‘This freedom to live in his provision grows over time and the opportunity God gives us to help others on this journey. It is an organic reality won in our relationship with him, not an act of hoping God will take care of us.’
ah, a great time of sharing…..i love how you commented on getting away from putting value on what God calls one to do by if they make money doing it or not….
i’ll have to read this again when i’m more awake ha ha!
thanks for sharing,
todd
I can relate to this so much! As a pastor of a fellowship that is now non-existant I on many occasions looked to the tithing box for provision rather than Father. Now it is different, He provides in the most peculiar ways, I at the moment am painting a friends house ha!ha! My wife Sharon and I have had a move on our hearts, we know it is of Father and we have had provision of $3000 for the move from Warwick Qld to Bundaberg Qld. We have had on our hearts a part time handyman service that provides with the freedom to be involved with those that Father enables us to be involved with.
We have had our fingers burnt from the “living by faith” thing and have had finacial struggles because we restricted our view in how Father provides, looking only through our ministerial means, even to the point of rejecting financial provision from others as I did handyman type work for them in the name of brotherly kindness, through this both parties are robbed form Father’s blessing sometimes.
I can relate to this so much! As a pastor of a fellowship that is now non-existant I on many occasions looked to the tithing box for provision rather than Father. Now it is different, He provides in the most peculiar ways, I at the moment am painting a friends house ha!ha! My wife Sharon and I have had a move on our hearts, we know it is of Father and we have had provision of $3000 for the move from Warwick Qld to Bundaberg Qld. We have had on our hearts a part time handyman service that provides with the freedom to be involved with those that Father enables us to be involved with.
We have had our fingers burnt from the “living by faith” thing and have had finacial struggles because we restricted our view in how Father provides, looking only through our ministerial means, even to the point of rejecting financial provision from others as I did handyman type work for them in the name of brotherly kindness, through this both parties are robbed form Father’s blessing sometimes.
I heard this very day that if we gave anyother way except through the local church that God wouldn’t get the glory, you would. I’m really really really struggling with the whole money and church thing. Heeeellllpppppp!
I heard this very day that if we gave anyother way except through the local church that God wouldn’t get the glory, you would. I’m really really really struggling with the whole money and church thing. Heeeellllpppppp!
As a pastor who is seriously thinking about making career change so I can truly follow what Christ has for me… this ariticle is incredibly helpful… thanks.
As a pastor who is seriously thinking about making career change so I can truly follow what Christ has for me… this ariticle is incredibly helpful… thanks.
It all sound like a well-oiled machine. I don’t know of anybody that cannot explain where each cent comes from which they received as a form of provisioning. I have been on my God-journey from 14 months. I believe that my household and I were reacting in accordance with what Father requested from us during this period, and still is. During this period we lived on funds that I can exactly explain each cent’s origin. Not one cent fell from the sky. For me to receive God’s provision, He must use a human provider. So this is my dilemma: the human channels that are supposed to funnel the provisions are uncooperative, unreliable or plainly not listening to God, or I have a wrong idea of how the provisioning-thing works.
It all sound like a well-oiled machine. I don’t know of anybody that cannot explain where each cent comes from which they received as a form of provisioning. I have been on my God-journey from 14 months. I believe that my household and I were reacting in accordance with what Father requested from us during this period, and still is. During this period we lived on funds that I can exactly explain each cent’s origin. Not one cent fell from the sky. For me to receive God’s provision, He must use a human provider. So this is my dilemma: the human channels that are supposed to funnel the provisions are uncooperative, unreliable or plainly not listening to God, or I have a wrong idea of how the provisioning-thing works.