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	<title>Comments on: Fruit without Soil</title>
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		<title>By: Fran</title>
		<link>http://lifestream.org/blog/2010/03/09/fruit-without-soil/comment-page-1/#comment-31752</link>
		<dc:creator>Fran</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 22:48:32 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lifestream.org/blog/?p=1140#comment-31752</guid>
		<description>We also go to a place kind of like that. I like talking to people to find out how they&#039;re doing. I am disappointed when the lights go down, the band starts playing and singers start clapping.  We get one other opportunity (meet and greet) to talk before the how to do it sermon starts.  After that&#039;s done then people rush off to the rest of their day. We are blessed to have a smaller venue that has been in place for over thirty years; a group of friends that have attended that same church.  But even that sometimes gets sidetracked by the larger gathering&#039;s agenda. My husband and I make a practive of wandering around to other fellowships where we know people to make connections.  We are thought of as strange for that but at least our friends are used to it by now.  And it&#039;s fun to bring people from different congregations together to talk together. They have more in common than they know!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>We also go to a place kind of like that. I like talking to people to find out how they&#8217;re doing. I am disappointed when the lights go down, the band starts playing and singers start clapping.  We get one other opportunity (meet and greet) to talk before the how to do it sermon starts.  After that&#8217;s done then people rush off to the rest of their day. We are blessed to have a smaller venue that has been in place for over thirty years; a group of friends that have attended that same church.  But even that sometimes gets sidetracked by the larger gathering&#8217;s agenda. My husband and I make a practive of wandering around to other fellowships where we know people to make connections.  We are thought of as strange for that but at least our friends are used to it by now.  And it&#8217;s fun to bring people from different congregations together to talk together. They have more in common than they know!</p>
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		<title>By: Dwain Wheeler</title>
		<link>http://lifestream.org/blog/2010/03/09/fruit-without-soil/comment-page-1/#comment-31750</link>
		<dc:creator>Dwain Wheeler</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 19:24:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lifestream.org/blog/?p=1140#comment-31750</guid>
		<description>My wife and I left a similar church situation two years ago.  However, we did not stop participating in a home group started by that church.  Now, though we attend very small church, who&#039;s pastor is firmly on the &quot;journey,&quot; we still enjoy fellowship with that group.  I know now that I&#039;m free from the &quot;system&quot; and can enjoy God&#039;s love, still enjoy the company of my friends, yet be free to seek God&#039;s will for me.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My wife and I left a similar church situation two years ago.  However, we did not stop participating in a home group started by that church.  Now, though we attend very small church, who&#8217;s pastor is firmly on the &#8220;journey,&#8221; we still enjoy fellowship with that group.  I know now that I&#8217;m free from the &#8220;system&#8221; and can enjoy God&#8217;s love, still enjoy the company of my friends, yet be free to seek God&#8217;s will for me.</p>
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		<title>By: Joel Brueseke</title>
		<link>http://lifestream.org/blog/2010/03/09/fruit-without-soil/comment-page-1/#comment-31749</link>
		<dc:creator>Joel Brueseke</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 18:25:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lifestream.org/blog/?p=1140#comment-31749</guid>
		<description>I was listening to Paul Anderson-Walsh speak a few years ago, and he commented Psalm 92.  His words have stuck with me.

Excerpt from Psalm 92:
&quot;The righteous will flourish like a &lt;i&gt;palm tree&lt;/i&gt;, they will grow like a cedar of Lebanon;
Planted in the house of the LORD, they will flourish in the courts of our God.
They will still bear fruit in old age, they will stay fresh and green...&quot;

Paul brought up something about palm trees. He said something like, &quot;Did you know that palm trees don&#039;t bear fruit during their first ten years?&quot; He went on to basically say that a palm tree spends that time getting its roots deeply and firmly established in the soil. If you look at the branches and leaves, the palm tree appears to simply be in a &quot;Godward gaze.&quot;  (Paul was speaking with Steve McVey, and that&#039;s a reference to Steve&#039;s book, Godward Gaze).

What I get out of this is that the palm tree&#039;s focus isn&#039;t bearing fruit, but rather the focus is getting established and rooted in the soil, and simply staring in the face of God.  But sadly indeed, the church today is focused on fruit, fruit, fruit, apart from the soil of God&#039;s unconditional love and pure grace.  What they &quot;bear&quot; ends up being nothing more than the plastic bowl of fruit that sits on kitchen tables.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I was listening to Paul Anderson-Walsh speak a few years ago, and he commented Psalm 92.  His words have stuck with me.</p>
<p>Excerpt from Psalm 92:<br />
&#8220;The righteous will flourish like a <i>palm tree</i>, they will grow like a cedar of Lebanon;<br />
Planted in the house of the LORD, they will flourish in the courts of our God.<br />
They will still bear fruit in old age, they will stay fresh and green&#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Paul brought up something about palm trees. He said something like, &#8220;Did you know that palm trees don&#8217;t bear fruit during their first ten years?&#8221; He went on to basically say that a palm tree spends that time getting its roots deeply and firmly established in the soil. If you look at the branches and leaves, the palm tree appears to simply be in a &#8220;Godward gaze.&#8221;  (Paul was speaking with Steve McVey, and that&#8217;s a reference to Steve&#8217;s book, Godward Gaze).</p>
<p>What I get out of this is that the palm tree&#8217;s focus isn&#8217;t bearing fruit, but rather the focus is getting established and rooted in the soil, and simply staring in the face of God.  But sadly indeed, the church today is focused on fruit, fruit, fruit, apart from the soil of God&#8217;s unconditional love and pure grace.  What they &#8220;bear&#8221; ends up being nothing more than the plastic bowl of fruit that sits on kitchen tables.</p>
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		<title>By: mark brown</title>
		<link>http://lifestream.org/blog/2010/03/09/fruit-without-soil/comment-page-1/#comment-31716</link>
		<dc:creator>mark brown</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 20:09:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://lifestream.org/blog/?p=1140#comment-31716</guid>
		<description>I&#039;m glad that you made it &quot;safely home&quot; (into Sarah&#039;s arms?) Wayne!  But it makes me pray for those who are not in physical safety in the land you visited... in so many ways, this world is not our home. 

Re: the family in the above post... we can so relate!

For our family, who are still somewhat &quot;connected&quot; in relationships with those attending services, I have seen the Lord love us all in ways that we might not have known if we&#039;d have quickly said &quot;Soyanora&quot; (I apologize for probable horrendous Japanese sp.).

We no longer see ourselves as traditional missionaries to the &quot;un-churched&quot; or the &quot;churched&quot;.  Now, instead of thinking of ourselves as specially annointed ones sent by God to make converts... to a different way of &quot;doing church&quot;, and then attempting to plant/start diff. churches... we once again remember that somewhere we have been called to make disciples... teaching them what Jesus is teaching us - Love (abide in Him, lay down our lives for others,...).  We now endeavor to walk deeper into the Son (Life and freedom) to live loved and loving our brethren wherever He has us.

Ah yes, sermons.  I have long ago been set free from placing any hope (whatsoever?) in another man to guide me into all truth.  There is no doubt that &quot;iron sharpens iron&quot; and we learn most completely from the Spirit of truth in his whole body... but we certainly don&#039;t receive that from one insecure man monologing week after week.  In letting go of that former hope, I have been set free to love the sermonizer... and to see that I am still very much like him; I would be not too different in his position... it is apparent that &quot;the position&quot; is the problem; even for a man after God&#039;s own heart!

know the blessings you already have in Christ, M.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;m glad that you made it &#8220;safely home&#8221; (into Sarah&#8217;s arms?) Wayne!  But it makes me pray for those who are not in physical safety in the land you visited&#8230; in so many ways, this world is not our home. </p>
<p>Re: the family in the above post&#8230; we can so relate!</p>
<p>For our family, who are still somewhat &#8220;connected&#8221; in relationships with those attending services, I have seen the Lord love us all in ways that we might not have known if we&#8217;d have quickly said &#8220;Soyanora&#8221; (I apologize for probable horrendous Japanese sp.).</p>
<p>We no longer see ourselves as traditional missionaries to the &#8220;un-churched&#8221; or the &#8220;churched&#8221;.  Now, instead of thinking of ourselves as specially annointed ones sent by God to make converts&#8230; to a different way of &#8220;doing church&#8221;, and then attempting to plant/start diff. churches&#8230; we once again remember that somewhere we have been called to make disciples&#8230; teaching them what Jesus is teaching us &#8211; Love (abide in Him, lay down our lives for others,&#8230;).  We now endeavor to walk deeper into the Son (Life and freedom) to live loved and loving our brethren wherever He has us.</p>
<p>Ah yes, sermons.  I have long ago been set free from placing any hope (whatsoever?) in another man to guide me into all truth.  There is no doubt that &#8220;iron sharpens iron&#8221; and we learn most completely from the Spirit of truth in his whole body&#8230; but we certainly don&#8217;t receive that from one insecure man monologing week after week.  In letting go of that former hope, I have been set free to love the sermonizer&#8230; and to see that I am still very much like him; I would be not too different in his position&#8230; it is apparent that &#8220;the position&#8221; is the problem; even for a man after God&#8217;s own heart!</p>
<p>know the blessings you already have in Christ, M.</p>
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